I know that Peyton/Leyton fans do, but I don't get it. I mean Brooke's the one that was left with all the insecurity issues. Peyton never did feel like she wasn't enough. Because Lucas always payed attention to her even when he was with Brooke. Peyton's the one who went after Lucas twice. She had to know how sensitive & insecure Brooke was. Like Brooke said Lucas meant everything to her. Probably because he was the only guy to see the real her. Ugh

^ Peyton did not go after Lucas twice. She went after him once, then buried her feelings for him the second time... for the sake of Brooke, and BL. Just had to clear that up. :)

But yes, I do sympathize with Peyton. And that's not to say that I don't also sympathize with Brooke, because I ofcourse do, for obvious reasons. But both girls deserve sympathy, just in different ways.

Brooke was hurt in obvious ways, but Peyton spent quite a bit of time quietly hurting on the inside... out of pure love for a boy that she was secretly longing for, but couldn't have. And not only could she not have him, she had to watch him be with her best friend... and even get used, strung along, and taken for granted by her. There were numerous times when Brooke didnt even seem to appreciate Lucas, and they spent most of their time together being unhappy, for no good reason. All the while Peyton was just in the background, being in love with him.

Peyton sacrificed her love for Lucas twice, for the sake of Brooke. When her feelings for Lucas were without a doubt 100x stronger, and deeper than Brooke's ever were. And we saw how much that killed her both times, but she still did it. So yes, I think she absolutely deserves sympathy. She's not a bad person for having feelings for Lucas, she's not. She was just a girl in love. And no matter how you twist it, she was just as hurt in the triangle drama as Brooke was, and deserves just as much sympathy. And my views on that will never change.

^ PREACH IT KELLY!!

^ lol :P

I'm just tired of it. Peyton may have never gotten cheated on, and she may not have insecurities... but in no way does that mean that she had it easy. Because she certainly didn't. For those of us who have ever been secretly in love with one of our best friends, but couldn't do anything about it, and had to watch them be with someone else (who didn't even seem to appreciate them nearly as much as you would)... then you know how much that hurts.

I've been there, I can relate to that situation. I'm sure many of us can. And because of that, I will always be team Peyton. I will always believe that SHE deserved to "get the boy" in the end, I will always sympathize with her, and I will always respect how she handled it. Because it's harder than it seems, and she just did the best that she could.

And can I also add that maybe "Lucas was the only guy to see the real her" because of the way Brooke chose to portray herself to others? lol that's her own fault that everyone portrayed her as just a party girl. Maybe if she would have spent more time being her "real" self, instead of getting drunk, naked, and trying to nail every guy she came in contact with... more people would have looked at her differently. Just sayin'.

completely. unlike Brooke, there was really no way around Peyton feeling hurt. it was out of her control. the boy you love being with your best friend, and your best friend cutting you out for being honest IS going to hurt, and rightfully so. but I feel like Brooke almost chose to feel hurt, and made things with the triangle and BL a big deal, when there was really no need for it. there was no need for her to freak out, and get all "insecurity-filled" every time Lucas merely spoke to Peyton. she seemed to make problems out of situations that really weren't problems. and when she wasn't doing that, she was (IMO) putting herself in situations where she would get hurt. I feel like brooke always created a lot of her own hurt. So no, I don't have nearly as much sympathy for her as I do for Peyton.

plus every single thing that kellyerin said!

I don't need to say anything. Kelly&Kristin said everything that needed to be said. <3

what kelly said, theres no necesary to repeat it

Not at all.

AT ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL.

Ever.

Not just because of the B/L/P drama. I've just never liked or sympathized with her and I never will.

(who didn't even seem to appreciate them nearly as much as you would)... then you know how much that hurts.


No. Just no. I'm in this EXACT same situation right now and if I EVER Handled it like Peyton I would have to go and shoot myself for being such a shitty person. Is it hard? Absolutely .. but there are MUCH better ways to deal with it than to destroy his relationship (TWICE. Everyone forgets about Lindsey - who he said I DO to!) and to kiss him? (Not talking about the 3x16 kiss because everyone seems to blame that on "nearly" dying) When he has a god dam girlfriend would be DISGUSTING of me. That 'I love him so he must be mine, no matter who I have to step on to get to him' is an EXCUSE. And a piss poor one at that.

.. I've been trying to be nice lately but this is just NO. SO MUCH NO.

^ Agree. Kissing him while he was with Lindsey was wrong, sure. I don't think anyone has ever denied that. But by that comment, and reference... I was talking about BLP, not LLP... just to clear that up!

And actually, in all fairness... Peyton didn't ruin his relationships with Brooke or Lindsey. Lucas did that himself. They both even said that it wasn't Peyton's fault.

I know. I just think in a lot of this Lindsey gets the even shorter part of the stick because she was "just" an obstacle or whatever. But LP hurt her too.

She still kissed him in S1. And was going to sleep with him until her hair got caught in his necklace. While he was dating Brooke. :|

I'm not saying Brooke was perfect, but in no way should anyone be able to justify all of Peyton's actions just because it was ~hard~ for her too.

Oh. Also I get making mistakes, everyone does, but not the same mistake .. THREE times & reacting in the same way every time.

No one is justifying Peyton's actions, though. We can (and always do, actually) admit that she was in the wrong with the kissing/cheating... but that doesn't mean that we can't still sympathize with her regarding other aspects of her story.

It seemed to me like you were saying "It's okay because Peyton really deserved him & Brooke + Lindsey didn't!" That's what I got out of it but whatever. I think it's ridiculous that Peyton is seen as some sort of ~epic character~ for how "gracefully" she handled everything.

We could go about 100 rounds on this though so I wave my white flag and go back to my BL love bubble. :)

It seemed to me like you were saying "It's okay because Peyton really deserved him & Brooke + Lindsey didn't!"

I meant that just in regards to Peyton's feelings for him vs. Brooke's feelings for him. I do think that Peyton appreciated him more, and that Brooke took her relationship with him for granted. If she cared about him as much as Peyton did, then she wouldn't have done a lot of the things that she did (ex. making unnecessary drama out of situations that really didn't warrant it, sleeping with Chris Keller, using Lucas in S4, etc.)

...Peyton never would have wasted her time with Lucas doing anything to that extent, and she never did. That's what I meant by that comment, that based on FEELINGS, and APPRECIATION for Lucas, I do think that Peyton deserves him more than Brooke. Not necessarily based on actions, if that makes sense.

But I agree... no point in going back and forth for hours. Agree to disagree! :)

NO! Never! and you know why? Cos she caused all the shit that ever happened to her?! [I don't mean her mum's dying or getting shot but everything else! Hell yes]

I hate Peyton's character for so many reasons - and NO! not just for BLP. always have and probably always will. I just hate the fact that she uses 'EXCUSES' to get out of rectifying her mistakes.

She was always a crap friend to Brooke and yeah yeah Brooke&Nathan and the sex tape but Peyton&Nathan had broke up unlike Lucas whom Brooke loved. Isn't that supposed to be forbidden! If my best friend was madly in love and I go kissing him/having an affair behind her back? what kind of person am I?

So Peyton was in love with him but she had her chance and she blew it?! Brooke asked her so many times [s1] and she denied any feelings or concealed them so when Brooke does start a relationship, Peyton realises actually she does have feelings for him!

even if she did have feelings for Lucas after Brucas started dating WHY THE FUCK hide the truth about the motel kiss! like Ally said if the necklace hadn't got stuck the would have gone the whole way and then Peyton would put on this whole drama about how she was insane cos she loved Lucas too much!

Peyton just doesn't know when to stop. Even with Lindsey! She had her chance with Lucas and she blew it.AGAIN! He moves on and is HAPPY! [if he wasn't he wouldn't have said I do!] and Peyton just had to be there constantly.. For mee, Peyton just liked the thrill of having something that she knew she couldn't have and when she couldn't she'd put her sad victim act on!

She wanted to have the cake and eat it!

^^ Can't sympathize with that!

**before anyone says- I know Brooke made her mistakes but she actually learnt from them and changed as a person. Peyton didn't!!

Yes, I sympathize with her. For the reasons Kelly mentioned and more.
In season 1, Brooke should have never gone after Lucas when she knew LP had feelings for each other, and that her best friend had trust issues. LP shouldn´t have cheated. Lucas shouldn´t have been with Brooke when he had feelings for Peyton. Peyton is not the only one to blame. After the cheating, Peyton was in love tih Lucas and broke things off because she didn´t want to hurt Brooke. She was in love and Lucas lover her back but she couldn´t be with him because she loved Brooke too much, that must have been really hard for her,
In Season 3 she didn´t go after Lucas or do anything wrong. She kissed Lucas goodbye when she thought she was dying. She told Brooke about her feelings for Lucas because she thought that was the right thing to do, and she lost her best friend over that. After that she sat back and didn´t do anything about it. She even helped Lucas with Brooke in season 4, no matter how much it was killing her.
Peyton was really hurt byt the triangle too and being in love with your best friends boyfriend and watching them together must be horrible.
Peyton is an amazing person & friend and I will always sympathize with her.

Yes, because when your best friend tells you 3 times that nothing is going on/she doesn't have feelings for Lucas .. you should read their mind and know that they're lying.

That's legit.

Ally, come on lol. Brooke knew perfectly well that LP had something going on between them, no matter what Peyton said.

At Nathan's party, she said "I dare you to show us all how you REALLY FEEL, kiss Lucas." ...so that alone shows that she knew what Peyton's real feelings were. Not to mention she spent the rest of that whole episode lying, and manipulating all for the sake of trying to keep LP away from each other. Why would she do that, if she thought there was nothing there between them? And as I've said a million times before, if she really thought that she wasn't doing anything wrong, she wouldn't have felt the need to ask Peyton 20 times if she was okay with it. Doesn't add up. She definitely knew about LP at that time.

I have some sympathy for Peyton, and i have some things that i just can't forget.

For me, no matter what Brooke may have known, knowing that LP had feelings for each other, it didn't give Peyton a free pass to kiss Lucas. {Not saying anyone is saying that it did!} I just... i can't excuse LP sneaking around instead of just being honest with Brooke. Lucas was a big boy, he made the decision to date Brooke, even after Peyton came to his house and confessed her feelings. So in S1, no i have no sympathy for Peyton.

She had opportunity after opportunity to be with Lucas, to tell Brooke that NO, she DIDN'T want her going after him etc.

S3/S4... I've come to see things a bit more objectively lately. I still don't like how Peyton handled things, she had to know Brooke was going to react badly so i wish she would have approached the situation differently, maybe told her about what happened with Jake as a preface to telling her about having feelings for Lucas...

I don't know... It's a complicated question for me i guess. I dealt with a friend betraying me over a guy when I was in high school, and it was a situation where she had so many chances to tell me how she felt, but instead she went behind my back and kissed him and then told me he kissed her and blah blah this isn't important but basically - it's hard for me to be subjective about this.

Peyton did wrong way before Brooke did anything wrong. Brooke was just reacting to being betrayed by her BESTFRIEND. Wouldn't we ALL react like Brooke did??

Am I sympathetic towards Peyton? Yes. A lot of the time.
Am I empathetic towards Peyton? Eh, some of the time.

Most of the times I empathize with Peyton are in scenes that do not involve Lucas or the BLP love triangle (for example when Ellie died, when she missed her dad, when she talked about her mom, when she missed Jake & Jenny, when she thought she was going to die in season 6...etc.). But there are a couple of scenes I can think of in which I am completely empathetic toward Peyton in regards to Lucas... and most of them are in season 5. When they break up in the flashback, when they fight in Trick, and when Peyton finds out Lucas is engaged and cries to Brooke. I watch those scenes and my heart breaks. I don't just feel bad for Peyton... I can feel her pain and it definitely makes me cry.

But most of the time I'm just sympathetic when it comes to Peyton in regards to BLP. I feel bad for her, but I don't experience her pain the way I do with Brooke. In season 1 I felt really bad that she was in love with her best friend's boyfriend. That's got to suck. In season 5 I felt bad for when she was hurt that Lucas was dating Lindsey- once again, it sucks when you love someone and they are involved with someone else. But in these instances was I empathetic? Not really. But I certainly was sympathetic.

And then there are times (like most of season 4) when I really don't empathize or sympathize (most of the time, but not all) with Peyton. I say not all because obviously I was sympathetic with the whole psycho-stalker situation, and also when she really just wanted her friendship back with Brooke and it seemed like Brooke was just too numb and hurt to even care.

Dina's post brings up a good question i meant to ask - Are you asking just in regards to the triangle? Or are you asking about our sympathy towards Peyton overall?

If we're talking overall than I have to add that i very much sympathize with her when it comes to losing her mom, losing Ellie, getting shot, having someone stalk her etc. Those are things that nobody deserves and obviously you feel bad.

*Ignores all the comments above* [I don't have the time to read them all]

She's my favorite female character ever <3 I love P. Sawyer!

Any person who isnt Leyton or Brucas would sympathize with Peyton. I mean Lucas was the light in her life and was always saving her. So many bad things happened that every time they did she just wanted to have light again. How can you blame her for that. She may have gone about it wrong sometimes but her intentions werent bad.

People always fight over whether Peyton was wrong or Brooke was wrong but for me it's Lucas that was wrong. I felt like Lucas was a liar and disingenuous for most of his run. Look, Peyton and Brooke had some friendship issues and some insecurities that had nothing to do with Lucas. I think Leyton vs brucas comes down in two ways. Either you relate to Peyton and her situation, being the odd one out, etc - or you relate to Brooke - never feeling good enough and wanting someone to love you despite that. Whichever you relate to, is the side you fall on. But we all forget to notice Lucas in all this. Lucas is so wrong so many times and quite frankly deserved neither Peyton, Brooke or Lindsey. I'll admit I fell hard for Brooke and Lucas. I'm a sucker for stories that involve a bad girl just wanted to be loved for the real her and a good boy coming along and seeing that goodness and loving her in spite of it all. Gets me everytime. But then it ended - and when it did I was ready because they really butchered brucas in the end. But my point is that Lucas CONVINCED me that he genuinely loved Brooke. But then he didn't. And ok fine. They realize the love coach had with his wife wasn't what they had and they both decide they're done. I was fine with that. I was even convinced that he had this epiphany that he loved Peyton that way. Great. Had their story ended or progressed from there, this argument would be completely different. But it wasn't. They break up shortly after for no real reason and Lucas (and Peyton) date and fall in love with other people but there's Lucas desperately clinging to someone other than Peyton again. Either he really doesn't love Peyton OR he's a real asshole for pretending like he loves someone else. Either way Leyton is forever ruined to me because of Lucas's behavior. He never chooses Peyton when it counts. Never. He settles and Peyton's love for Lucas deserves so much more than that. So yes I sympathize with Peyton even though I was at one time a brucas fan - however it's because I think Peyton's passionate love deserved something more than The way Lucas chose to love her